Platoon Leader

Tell me what you think about UAR.
Znimu
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:25 am

Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:16 am

Hello,

Please tell me what you think about this class. I find the PL a bit weak, his aura is great but I don't find very funny to be reduced to an aura provider.

I think to replace the CFF (provided by Leadership Skill lvl 4) by a new ability which would allow the PL to call to him every soldiers : every soldier would have to accept or not, then a phantom would recover every soldiers who accepted. Then the phantom would fly again to drop everybody near the PL. What do you think about this ability ? :)

Kami no Varou
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Kami no Varou » Thu Mar 17, 2016 1:39 pm

I indeed feel the PL is lacking something. Yet all his abilities are pretty fitting to me. I'd rather exchange Marksmanship for something more specific, or maybe Plasma Grenade, so he becomes something different than an improved Rifleman.
Yet, I don't like at all this suggestion - its applications seems weird and possibly cheated.

Znimu
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:25 am

Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:55 pm

The cooldown would be quite long, and / or with 3 charges only for a game (so only one by chapter), or something like that.

It could be used to save only one soldier (if everybody else refuse), or to redepoly everybody. The more people accept, the most time it needs to pick everybody as the phantom has to go to each soldier.

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Billyum
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Billyum » Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:41 pm

The PL is much stronger when you have the Instructor SI unlocked. PL is one of my favorite MOSs and I think that his skills are just fine the way they are.

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:03 am

As I said, an aura provider, and some support skills. I think he could be more amusing or active, or even attractive for most people. It is a very advanced class and the gameplay seems almost the same than the rifleman with only little differences. He may be very usefull in highest difficulties to buff the well organized team, but in most games, it is not really the case, excepted when everybody is defending the airport. And a SFAAT can take IS and the other aura SI too.

Do you often use CFF ? Or once in 10 games ? If there is a FSS, I think that using CFF with a PL is a waste, so it may happen only in emergency and could mostly be avoided.

I know that I propose a very singular ability compared to what you are used to. Personally I don't live in the past, and I can see how games would benefit of it. I even think that it would add a new strategic dimension to the games.
And it is probably what want people, new things, new ways of playing, new discoveries.

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Fri Mar 18, 2016 1:11 am

Maybe I just want to have fun building something, after having past so much time on the timers.
But it doesn't change what I have written. I still think all that.

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Billyum
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Billyum » Fri Mar 18, 2016 5:08 am

"Do you often use CFF ? Or once in 10 games ?"
Probably closer to once in 5 games, But in those games it is very nice to have. The thing about PL is that because he is so support based if you have a team that isn't very good then your support isn't as useful. CFF allows you to be more useful to your team when there aren't as many people alive. Yes if you have an FSS you don't want to waste his shells, But sometimes you either don't have an FSS or just absolutely need to use those shells to save the game from failing.

"As I said, an aura provider, and some support skills. I think he could be more amusing or active, or even attractive for most people. It is a very advanced class and the gameplay seems almost the same than the rifleman with only little differences."
For people like me who like support classes above all others, The PL is a very fun MOS to play. Before I had PL unlocked there were games where I would be playing as Rifleman and think to myself "I really wish I had binos right now, Even if I had lower dps to compensate" or "If I was medic I could heal that guy". Yes the PL is a lot like a Rifleman, But I wouldn't call his support abilities "little differences".

"Personally I don't live in the past, and I can see how games would benefit of it. I even think that it would add a new strategic dimension to the games. And it is probably what want people, new things, new ways of playing, new discoveries."
When thinking about how good of a job Illidan did on UA3 I do admit that it is hard not being at least a little bit "stuck in the past". To this day there are still new versions of his map being made including yours. I feel that the reason why so much effort is being put in to keeping this idea alive is because people want to keep playing his game. I think that the best way to move forward would be to expand upon what UA3 was, Not to try and change it into something else. I know that what you are proposing is only one change to one MOS, I just feel like removing a skill even if compared to other skills it isn't used that much isn't the way to go.

Imagine if Blizzard went through with it's idea to remove Carriers from SC2 during Heart of the Swarm and replace them with the Tempest, Doesn't make much sense calling it an expansion if content is being removed. Instead they kept the Carrier in and added the Tempest along side it and all the Protoss players [Including myself] were much happier because of it.

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Fri Mar 18, 2016 5:43 am

Your arguments are good. I may have not played him enough to really know, so do you really think that the PL is enough powerfull right now ? I think his aura is, but he is not always in situations where his aura does miracles, as it depends on the classes choosed by the others, and if they are near or not.

Before to down a little the SFAAT (the LN actually), I am trying to up the classes which need it. Which classes could need an improvement in your opinion ?

I agree that Illidan did an amazing job. It is why I am working on his map :)
I even don't pretend to do same amazing job, I just do what I can, the way that suits me, and hopefully some people seem to appreciate. For this project I had and still have to watch forward, else it won't move.

Well i guess I will keep this redeploy idea for something else, maybe an item or a SI, or a new class. But I was thinking it was totally related to a platoon leader. Maybe a specific SI for the PL then, or would it be to powerfull for a SI ? Anyways the power of this skill can be adjusted by the move speed of the phantom, and the speed to recover a soldier too, and the number of charges.

JoeD already gave me the idea of a SI specific to the engineer : add a slot to the Is Bot.

Kami no Varou
Posts: 142
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Kami no Varou » Fri Mar 18, 2016 7:47 am

To be honest, I think PL need changement. But I agree with Billyum that his skills are fine - and fitting. As I said, I'd rather remove Marksmanship and give him that SS2 Marksmanship remplacement, like Medic or FSS, if I wanted to had something. But atm I don't really have ideas of what to had - I dislike your ability, seems too game breaking to me. I guess I could change my mind upon trying it though.
The thing is, when I want to support my team DPS, I'd rather take Medic with aura SI (atm I only have BL) and go for enhancements - the buff is way stronger and more useful if you use it on a DPS class (say AR/Cyborg/SDM). Not to mention, although Concentrate Fire is nice, I feel more I'm doing something with Medic. Well I like PL too, but if you consider Medic has Marksmanship with SS2 and that he profit half the time from his own buff, I feel like it's just more effective - unless maybe the team has 2AR+Cyborg+SDM.
So, althought there's differences (and I can be mistaken too), when one start arguing over why a basic Medic is better to support the DPS of his team over PL - which is supposed to be designed for it -, there's an issue to me.
Yet, as I said, I have no suggestion atm.
EDIT : to answer, I'd say that PL and Flamethrower are the classes that deserve the most attention, but I already mentionned Flamethrower and you took good care of it =)
On a comepletely different topic, what do you think of Rifleman DPS compared to Cyborg and AR ? I'm not really a Cyborg player but his DPS scales increadibly fast, while AR DPS grow very high, yet with Focus Fire + SOF-AR increasing critical chance to 27.5 (right ?) at level 6 if you're lucky enough to get a SOF-AR, I sometime think it might be pretty good in the end. And he compensate the lack of Suppressive Fire on his DPS with more utility Ground Flare and Smoke Grenade. I heard say there was no point in taking Rifleman compared to other classes, but I quite question it.

Znimu
Posts: 1190
Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:25 am

Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:33 pm

I think that this redeploy ability is not game breaking compared to a SFAAT who can stay afk at Thalim, and finish first in kills. Highest dps even with auto-attacks of LN AR, meat shield, and even support abilities if needed.

I don't really know why it angers you Billyum, we are just speaking right now, nothing has been done. I try to get opinions, but kind of "I disagree." is not a constructive opinion. I can't take that in consideration. But I listen to clever and constructed arguments. (If you'd like to know why I know it angers you, just pm me. Else no worries)


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