Platoon Leader

Tell me what you think about UAR.
Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:23 pm

Something still bothers me about the PL, but it is complicated. With a recruitement ability, he would lose some survivability because of the micro needed and it would increase a lot the difficulty to play him (except for people who sleep in Thalim of course). With more fighting skills he may become more powerfull than the rifleman.

We could build a fifth tree, but it would require to find enough skills and passives in agreement of his role, so utility oriented in my opinion.

There is so many suggestions in this topic, quite hard to get an idea of what to do.

Antomidus
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Antomidus » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:23 pm

I think platoon leader skills should still be based around the leader aspect a PL standing somewhere alone should be realy bad. Things that would come to my mind would be maybe:

- Supply Drops for equipment/ammo (probably realy op :D )
- Some skills that help him commanding the team (obtaining vision from teammembers maybe linking vision of 2 teammembers together, getting a TL marker for whole team such things)
- Active skill that shortly boosts movement speed in a small radius around him (like cyborg just for all allied troops in the radius)

Also if i remember correctly the platoon leader in UA 2 had 2 riflemen as bodyguards that he couldn't control himself but followed him around and shot at everything maybe also an idea.

greets

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:31 pm

I like the idea of a short movement speed boost around the PL. It would add teamplay, lead people to play more as a team.
Not sure about the supply drop, I don't think that it is a Platoon leader responsability, and that it would fit with the actual items drops. It would have indeed balance issues.
By linking 2 people together, not sure if it is what you mean, but the PL could choose a soldier to get his vision for some time maybe.

More ideas like the speed boost would be great I think. Active teamplay oriented abilities, but I have no ideas right now.

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FrozenAngel
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby FrozenAngel » Mon Jun 27, 2016 7:15 am

The speed boost is a nice idea. though we already have vision on PL. he has Laser Designation right? That gives vision and reduces armor of target, vision is for the whole team, right? So I don't think he needs other forms of vision granting.

Kami no Varou
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Kami no Varou » Mon Jun 27, 2016 9:05 am

I think the PL could indeed have some more effects on his mates but only if they follow his commands. For exemple, that movespeed thing, he gives a buff to his nearby allies that increase by a great amount ms for a while, but they loose this buff if they stop running. We could adapt Concentrate Fire with the same system : in addition to current bonus, it gives also a bit of attack range, but on the opposite, people will loose this buff if they start moving.
That gives the PL more versatility, and potentially more impact, while also fitting more to his role and being more reliant on teamwork. That would also in his case give more importance to FT because it's the only way atm to give real directives (without typing them, which can also work with simple commands like -' attack-).

I think if we gather enough ideas we could split his actual Leadership tree in two, one real Leadership, that gives the area bonus as well as those buffs like the ms (let's call it "Retreat" ^^) or Concentrate Fire, and a more utility tree - that I have no name for ^^' - with Field Aid, Binocculars and CFF.
Although I have no doubt most people are gonna priorize Leadership, it would still give a real choice about the order you level up your skills too. Well, atm, we need more ideas, if you ever agree to it, as to how to fill these trees.

To come back (from very far ^^') to your idea (and although I was the first claiming I didn't like it any bit), we could add a redeploy ability where the PL summon after a couple of second one dropship (not a full phantom, and without weapon) at PL position. The dropship stays a couple of seconds during which every ally can load in, and then fly to an area designed by the PL upon calling it, and unloads everyone. The PL decides when the dropship take off, it is unarmed and vulnerable, so it requires once again a great unity in between the squad to not leave anyone behind while still taking off before the ship is endangered.
(I'd put it on the utility tree btw - lvl 3?)
I think this way I like it (as opposing to the calling everyone back to PL position thing).
(yeah, I know I stated clearly this idea sucked and now I get back on my words - but hey, only fools don't change their mind ^^')

Alright, that's what I finally came for PL after a bit of thinking. What do you think ?

EDIT : Problem with redeploy thing also is what if landing zone is actually a ball of zombies ? Everyone get trapped and die ? (or at least get a couple hits). Meanwhile, if you can choose in real time the landing zone, it gets very strong imo. I guess you could add a push-back effect on landing zone upon arrival - but then I feel like you could abuse it (like call a redeploy without anyone loading just so you can launch the ship to destination and push-back zombies (which once again could maybe be prevented by forcing PL into the ship (and maybe addind a minimal travel distance ? (I should stop coffee (damn, I don't drink coffe 'cause I don't like it (then I should stop... tea ? (screw this))))))) (hm... sorry...)

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:05 pm

Some interesting ideas.
About the Retreat, I think that it should not be removed as soon as someone stops moving, but if he doesn't move for maybe 1s.
About the Concentrated fire, there is a sort of same issue. The soldiers who frequently have to move, like flamers, shotguns classes (mainly the short ranged classes I think), would lose the buff even if they are attacking but the way indicated by their gameplay. Maybe the buff could be removed if a soldier doesn't attack for 2s.
And for both skills, it would have to be removed anyways after some time too.

I think that you are going in the right direction, separating the fight abilities from the utility abilities.
So we would get :

LEADERSHIP (PL aura with each level) :
- lvl 1 : Skill which provides to the PL the vision of an other soldier for some time ?
- lvl 2 : Retreat ?
- lvl 3 : Redeploy ?
- lvl 4 : Concentrate fire

NO NAME YET (utility oriented, may need a passive bonus or something with each level too) :
- lvl 1 : Binocculars ?
- lvl 2 : Field aid ?
- lvl 3 : Laser designator
- lvl 4 : CFF

Redeploy may need to be discussed, I am not fully OK with your changes.

Kami no Varou
Posts: 142
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Kami no Varou » Wed Jun 29, 2016 12:22 pm

Let's just gather opinions.

Atm it's Laser Designator instead of Flare Gun, and I prefer it this way. Also atm it's Binoccular lvl1 and Field Aid lvl2, and I also prefer it this way.
Maybe we can grant a level improvement on Binocculars like for SDM ? That's pretty much his only way to see what's incoming if he doesn't have a recon MoS

I fear for his nade though, it's already barely used, if we add another tree, it will become completely a ghost ability (no pun intended ^^' (okay, maybe a bit)).
I like the compromise you have to make between utility, leadership and DPS.
I feel Redeploy would be more like a Utility thing, no ?

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Thu Jun 30, 2016 5:22 pm

I have edited my post.

Not sure about the passive for binoculars, I think that the PL uses it rarely. An other idea would be to provide a duration bonus to some Leadership skills like Retreat (lvl 1 and 2 would add few seconds) and Concentrate fire (lvl 3 and 4 would add few seconds). So it would build a synergy between the 2 trees.

About the plasma grenade, I think that it is few used even by ghosts because of the high energy cost. I may lower it slightly soon if nobody disagrees.

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Billyum
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Billyum » Wed Jul 06, 2016 4:51 am

Znimu wrote:Not sure about the passive for binoculars, I think that the PL uses it rarely.

No wonder you think that PL is too weak =]

Znimu wrote:About the plasma grenade, I think that it is few used even by ghosts because of the high energy cost. I may lower it slightly soon if nobody disagrees.

One thing I was thinking was each level of Frag nade and Plasma nade could give +1 mech point, I don't know if it would be enough to make them worth getting in standard modes for Cav scout,PL, or Ghost though. Perhaps unique buffs from maxing other trees much like Rifleman's MGL upgrade.

Znimu
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Re: Platoon Leader

Postby Znimu » Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:42 am

Maybe I am wrong, but I think that the binos are usefull for a SDM or a FSS to attack from long range, but for a PL ?

I understand your point to give a mecha point, but it would be such easier and less work to lower the cost of the grenade. I don't know, a mecha passive could revaluate the grenades indeed.


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